Episode: 296 |
Eli Diament:
B2B Surveys:


Eli Diament

B2B Surveys

Show Notes

McKinsey alum Eli Diament is the Founder and Director of Azurite Consulting, which specializes in conducting B2B surveys that require high volumes of niche B2B buyers, decision makers, and product users.

In this episode, Eli discusses the principles behind constructing a B2B survey that will yield useful insights, and some of the issues to be mindful of when engaging a survey firm.

Learn more about Azurite Consulting at: https://www.azuriteconsulting.com/

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Will Bachman 00:00
So, hello, and welcome to Unleashed the show that explores how to thrive as an independent professional Unleashed is produced by Umbrex, which connects you with the world’s top independent management consultants. I’m your host Will Bachman. And I’m excited to be here today with Eli diamond, who is the founder of azurite Consulting, which does b2b surveys, and perhaps some other types of surveys that Eli will tell us about. Eli, welcome to the show.

Eli Diament 00:29
Thanks. Well, it’s a super honor to be on the show. It’s amazing to be a part of Umbrex. We’ve been building this for many years, and we’ve been able to create is awesome. And the virtual consulting firm we bring to all of our clients and talent we bring to them. It’s been amazing. So thanks for having me. Well, thank

Will Bachman 00:44
you for those very kind words, you lay I, you know, I’ve been familiar with the work of your firm. And we’ve collaborated a couple things. Talk a little bit about just for listeners, give us an overview of azurite Consulting, and the survey capability that you have developed and maybe how it’s differentiated or why you felt that there was place in the market for for what your firm offers.

Eli Diament 01:09
Yeah, well, thanks. So at the at the highest level azurite provides private equity, hedge funds and enterprise clients with unique primary research. We do it based on a range of proprietary approaches, which we’ve developed through the years. And we help our clients find precise people and ask them questions in a very unique way. And when you think about what we bring to the table, what we’re doing is we’re finding very difficult to find populations in large volumes with precisions. And we’re doing it without the help of panel providers or expert networks. And I can unpick that in a little. But you can imagine, if you’re a private equity client, and you’re one of our clients, they’re writing checks in hundreds of millions of dollars, and they’re interested in gathering data that is accurate. They don’t want bland imprecise panels or expert networks, they don’t want people that are tangentially relevant. They want real people, real decision makers that are going to bring them conviction in their deal. And that’s what we do. We couple that with some McKinsey style, thought partnership, very creative ways of asking questions and deep depth of research methodology. And we’re able to deliver something very unique to our hedge funds, private equity and enterprise clients.

Will Bachman 02:21
So give us an example of when you say very precise, and the right kind of respondent, give us an example of one of the profiles that you would have looked for recently, and the kinds of questions that you might be asking.

Eli Diament 02:40
Sure, um, I love questions like that, because it’s kind of fun, sometimes who were looking at, and it’s very varied. We’ve been asked to look at everything from hair salon owners who purchase hair extensions, and I can speak at length about the hair extension market and the number of women that are getting hair extensions that aren’t telling us. We’ve been asked to look at spray on grass for civil construction projects and the engineers and purchase decision makers buying spray on grass. We’ve been asked about sports software for for high schools and colleges, we’ve been asked about a range of very varied individuals, the list goes on and on, we probably found at this point 60 to 75 different nation esoteric populations in high volume. So we’re talking about 300 400 600, sometimes 1000 individuals that are the purchase decision makers in a b2b setting of these niche populations.

Will Bachman 03:44
Okay, so you mentioned panel providers a couple of times for listeners that aren’t necessarily in this world. Explain to us how the traditional b2b surveys work. And you know, what, our panel providers?

Eli Diament 03:59
Yeah, I think that’s a great question. Well, I think the way I may answer that is, let me tell you why we started as right and it gets to the heart of that. And it gets to what we were trying to solve and what we’re trying to fix. Um, so I started as right after leaving McKinsey in 2000, and system. As you’re aware, when you’re at a big consulting firm, you’re reaching out to panel providers and expert networks. And we all know their names that GLG alpha sides do not have used to be research now the world and we’re asking them to provide us with experts, individuals help us answer our questions on behalf of our clients. And what I found that my time at Oliver Wyman and McKinsey was that we do 20, sometimes 30 interviews and look back and say, huh, three to five of those folks were really good, but the rest of the men, they were a little bit painful. And so I left thinking there has to be a better way to do this. It’s 2015 is the whole internet available. There has to be a better way to do this for us. And so that’s why we found it as right And what we did is we broke that problem down into two parts. The first part was finding the exact right people to answer our questions. And the second part was segmenting them in a way and asking the questions in a way where you could actually gather the insight and data that gets to some of the survey expertise that we were talking about before. So the traditional way of running a survey, if you’re a b2b company, or even a b2c company, is you go to one of these expert networks or panel providers. And these are, these are people farms, if you will, they get people to sign up, and they keep a large database of people. And then they send them invites once a week, once a month to participate in something that they may tangentially be aware about or may potentially be purchasing. And that’s how research used to get done, you would go to a panel provider or an expert network, they’d look in their database, they’d say, we have 30 of these people, I can probably get your 20 on the phone. What we do is we use anything available to us, we don’t have any databases, we don’t go to these expert networks, panel providers, we build that group of people that persona and that population from scratch each and every time. So the way we look at the world is we say how many people are in the universe of the geography that you want to answer the questions. And so if you’re looking at the United States, and you’re looking at hair salon owners to the example I gave before, we’re looking for, we can think about every hair salon owner, the United States and how many of them there are. And we can get to a large volume of them very quickly, usually two to three weeks, and and pull them through our unique survey, which I talked about, and gather information from them. And so what you get back as a client is instead of getting 20 or 30, hair salon owners, you’re gonna get 460 hair salon owners who buy hair extensions, and the ability to bring that volume and that level of depth of data to decisions that never existed before us. And so that’s that’s how we’re changing the research world in the b2b space away from these panel providers or expert networks.

Will Bachman 07:05
That’s very cool. Now, I know that there’s some secret sauce in here that you probably you don’t want to share, because proprietary, but I’d love to hear whatever you’re willing to share with us on. You know, in that example, hair salon owners there, they’re probably a lot of them are not necessarily on LinkedIn. Right? I suppose you could go, you know, if you’re asking if I was going to try to approach this, I’d say well, I don’t know, maybe I’ll look on Google to find, you know, the hair salons in every city or you know, like the Yellow Pages, or something to try to come up with a list of all the hair salons. But then I’m not sure how would actually find the owners of those other than just, you know, calling each one and saying, Hey, what’s the owner? And what’s their name? You know, I mean, maybe if maybe hair salons need to get registered in each state. So maybe there’s some kind of, you know, state kind of foi kind of certificates or the where you could get a list of hair salon owners from the state, perhaps depending on the state, but then that’d be going each state, I’d love to hear for a problem like this sort of how you would go about actually generating that list of the hair salon owners and getting their contact info.

Eli Diament 08:19
Yeah, 100%. So we get that question a lot. How do you do it. And so the way I like to describe it to people is as follows. Imagine you had built algorithms and a bunch of systems and processes that would allow you to take anything that is available anywhere on the internet. So we’re talking Google, Twitter, Instagram, Facebook, LinkedIn, anything on any website, anything anywhere, collected very quickly, filter it, and segment in in a way that’s going to allow you to find the right people, and then have another methodology to reach out and contact them. So we have 12 different channels that we use to reach the exact individuals that we want, and some more for certain surveys and others don’t. And others work well for other surveys. And so the screeners on our surveys are fairly intense, and are really focused in on finding the exact decision maker with the exact experience in their current role, so that we can gather their information and then we do so anonymously. So one of the big features about us is we we protect the anonymity of our respondents so that they feel comfortable giving information that’s not strategic, not proprietary, not confidential, but that they’re honest with us about the questions we’re asking and we never we never go that we never want strategic confidential or proprietary information. We just can’t do that. But we can ask all kinds of questions that allow our clients to be able to answer this.

Will Bachman 09:44
You mentioned some of the screener type questions give me example of how you would screen how you would screen to make sure that you’re getting legit people who really know the the particular in a really have the expertise. You’re looking for

Eli Diament 10:00
We put a range of questions in there. So a lot of times our clients are concerned about the size of the companies or the amount of purchases that they’ve made of a specific product or service in the past. Or we’ll ask them specific brands, and we may do some blind brand testing to see can they give us blind brands without being prompted with the list. So we’re doing a range of we’re asking questions in a range of different ways to make sure that the responses we’re getting back are legit. And then the other thing that we’re always doing with our data, and it’s one of the the high bars that we set is we’re combing through each and every single one of the individual responses to make sure that they tell a story, we need to make sure that if you’re a hair salon owner who says that you’ve done x, that you’ve actually done x based on the remaining questions in the survey. And if we start to see things like scattergram questions, or lots of just random selections, we’ll throw your answer out. It’s not relevant, or it’s not high quality.

Will Bachman 10:59
What are some things that someone should be aware of, you know, if they’re, if they’re, you know, when they’re, when they’re engaging a b2b survey firm have some things behind the scenes that can reduce the quality of a survey that might not be obvious to the purchaser of that survey?

Eli Diament 11:18
Yeah, so I think this, there’s a couple of things that it’s a really good question, because I think a lot of people aren’t fully aware of some of the the pitfalls, if you will, on that existing primary research. And there’s certain things that are really important. So I would start with the quality of the respondent is extremely important. And so if you’re going to retire to emphasize network, that sending invites out on a weekly basis to individuals, people are going to get what we’ve termed survey fatigue. So they’re just going to try and take every survey that comes to them. And they’re going to be trained to just click in through the screeners and one in five, they’ll make it through. And so in a lot of ways, the quality of the respondents set being fresh, unique, real, not tired. Is is very important. The next layer that I would talk to is that quality control layer that we were just talking to ensuring that each and every response is a good response, calling people to verify their responses. Being obsessive about the quality is another angle of and another pitfall that you sometimes find with other providers. And the final thing I would say is, actually there’s two things I would say. The third one is something you find a lot of times with other consulting firms, other firms, I’m not going to use names, still go to the standard panel providers, expert networks, and just common name research providers. And then those consulting firms slap their name on the report and call it good enough. But it’s still the same as going directly to those expert panels. And research providers and panel providers, yourselves. And so you’re still getting the same quality or lack of quality that they offer. And the final thing that they may offer on top and this is where I really think we we really have a leg up is the research expertise. We’ve we’ve run 65 surveys in the last two years. We know research methodologies, we know about skewing, we know different ways of answering question through different approaches to asking questions. The could major consulting firms, you may actually just get an associate and this is the first survey that they’ve written versus going to a real research provider, you’ll know that they have 6500 surveys under their belt.

Will Bachman 13:44
Okay, let’s talk now a little bit about the actual content of the survey itself. So what are some of the tips and tricks that you’ve learned that maybe a more naive, associate, you know, writing a first survey would not think about that? What have you learned about writing surveys to make them either in terms of the order or the phrasing of questions to make sure you get the insights you’re looking for?

Eli Diament 14:10
Yeah, really good question. Well, and it is complex. I think I would start with the following. When you’re writing a survey, you always want to keep the research objective in mind. So whether you’re doing a diligence survey, a performance improvement, survey, demand funnel, something around r&d, strategic go to market, all of these things. You can write surveys and research to help bring data to answer the questions for clients or, but you always want to work backwards from what is that research objective, and you want to ensure that their survey and the research that you’re writing is testing different angles against that research objective, and answering it in different ways. And it is me see if you will, if you go back to our McKinsey days mutually exclusive, collectively exhaustive. Making sure that you’re answering the meaning See set of questions across the survey is invaluable to our clients. And then to your point, getting into the actual mechanics of the survey, what are matters? First questions they get asked will skew their answers to their later questions. So everyone loves NPS Net Promoter scores. This was created by Bain and company many years ago, it’s sort of the the standard end user at work or personal satisfaction. So recommendation, would you recommend this product to a friend or colleague or friend and family member? depending on how you want to ask if you put that question at the end of a survey, and you asked the person, the individual before that all kinds of questions about what they think is important, what’s working well, what’s not working, well, why they bought it, why they didn’t buy it. What’s going to end up happening is when they get to that NPS question, they’re going to have all that in their head. And that’s going to be skewing the response. And that was never the intent of NPS. And so if you do that, you’ll have a non benchmark trouble, bench markable NPS score, you need to put NPS right up front in the very beginning. So that it’s a pulse test, it’s a very quick gut feel for would you recommend them or not? And then you can get into all the different mechanics of the survey that you’re going for. There’s numerous other examples, why would you use a one to five versus a one to seven versus a zero to 10? scale? Should you be asking things around? Agree to disagree, or on a likelihood scale? There’s all these different mechanics that I would recommend everyone who’s writing surveys, really think about and think about, when you’re writing the question, are you skewing or leading the respondent in a certain direction? That’s going to mess with your results? Or are you asking it in a neutral way? If that’s your intent, to be able to gather the data and then report back the neutral finding without a skewed answer? So a lot of the work we do as you can hear with clients is preventing skew and results, whether it’s in the population or the way the surveys, do

Will Bachman 17:02
you have kind of names? Are there sort of a dozen types of questions that get asked them curious if you deserve to have the kind of sort of names for those different types?

Eli Diament 17:13
Yeah, we there’s a series of questions. And it really again, this goes back to what I was saying before about research objectives, starting with the research objective and working through and asking the appropriate questions and being nice about it. The depending on the style of survey that you’re going for, you’re going to ask a different set of archetypical set of questions, we kind of have a menu that we refer back to that we’ve created. But for sure, you’re going to see lots of times awareness, questions of different brands, consideration questions, did you consider their products? Did you purchase the products? What products Did you purchase? And then once you can zoom in and understand what products the actual decision maker that you’re speaking to in the survey has purchased, you can ask what was most important on that purchase decision, you can ask them to compare between different brands, each one of those different important or not important spectrum or decision making criteria, you can ask them around likelihood to switch difficulty of switching, you can ask them their views on different competitors and who they would switch to you can see really, what makes surveys fun for me actually is it’s it’s it’s multiple hypothesis testing in this big puzzle that you’re putting together. And you’re basically trying to say, I need to figure out x, what is going to be the best series of questions to figure out x for my client in a non skewed way that’s going to get them the data that they need a big puzzle that’s kind of fun to solve. And I kind of enjoy it in some odd way.

Will Bachman 18:41
When you when you look at kind of a maybe initial survey drafts that you get from your clients, if they if they’ve done such a thing. Do you feel that often they’re asking maybe too many questions are trying to cover too much ground or asking questions that are just not that important? And you can help convince them to drop?

Eli Diament 19:04
It varies? It depends on the client and the objective. We have some clients that don’t feel they can we have some clients that put way too many questions in and we’re constantly advising them to call back because you’re not going to get the brain battery from a respondent that will last that long on other clients where we advise them to ask their questions differently. So it really it really varies from client to client. And again, like I was talking about before, it really goes back to that research objective. And starting from what is the research objective? What are we trying to answer? And then what is going to be the best series of questions that’s going to answer that in the time that we have with the respondents, which is usually 15 to 20 minutes.

Will Bachman 19:46
to kind of do learning Have you tried much kind of a b testing of trying, you know, asking the same question, but in with a one to five scale or one to seven scale to sort of see how those things skewed. The results

Eli Diament 20:02
we have, and we sometimes ask in verses as well. So we’ll ask at one point in the survey, the positive approach, and at some point in the survey and evidence negative approach, and see if the answers change through the survey or seeing if it is a series of questions that the individual has gone through has shifted their thinking, since

Will Bachman 20:22
What about question bank, you mentioned that you sort of almost have templates for different types of objectives? Have you developed a question bank of ways to phrase things that you can pull from?

Eli Diament 20:35
We haven’t developed menus, because each one of our surveys and objectives and client needs and industries and topics is so different, that we don’t have the ability to say, Okay, this is how we’re always asking this question verbatim. But what we have developed is standards. So when we ask a spectrum question, we’re relatively insistent that you start with the question first, and then provide the spectrum after. So for example, a lot of our clients like to write on a scale of one through 10, please answer, please indicate your likelihood of x. That’s not how our brains think our brains are thinking one in 10, one through 10, one through 10. Wait, what do you want me to ask? What what are you asking me? versus the way you want to ask a question like that is how likely are you to do X activity? Please answer on a scale of one through 10. And that way, your brain is actually able to say, ah, top down? How likely That’s the question. You want me to answer one through 10? Got it. And by doing things like that, you don’t exhaust and frustrate your respondents,

Will Bachman 21:36
where do you land in terms of these different ranges? I guess I tend to, I mean, I tend to kind of like the one to five most of the time, where it’s, you know, extremely dislike it, I dislike it of neutral. I like it, I love it, you know, sort of doing it like that, I find my brain having a harder time making a seven part or an 11 part distinction. But do you find that some ranges work better with some types of questions?

Eli Diament 22:07
Yeah, for sure. The two factors that typically lead into the range for us are the number of respondents that are going to be going through the question and the breadth of potential answers. So on a scale of likelihood, we probably are going to go through a 10 point scale versus a disagreement, whether you agree or disagree will probably be on a five or seven point scale, just because as you say, the brain can’t conceptualize more than psych slightly, somewhat and extremely on either side of a central point. And so 100% it really depends on the question that you’re asking the answers, and again, the number of respondents that are going to be going to that question.

Will Bachman 22:51
Alright, cool. Let’s talk. One other area, I wanted to explore about your about your customers, you mentioned, I think, pe and VC and some corporate customers, what, what are the what why is the? What are the kind of the situations that they’re often doing? Is it around due diligence about a potential acquisition? Or, you know, considering a new product launch? Or? Or what are the types of needs that you get pulled into most often?

Eli Diament 23:27
A good question. And it varies by our type of client. And so like you said, we have three types of clients, private equity, hedge funds, and enterprises. So undertake each one of those, these, it’s a little bit different for each. On the private equity, you got two sides, you have your diligence, or deal flow side, and then you have the operating company or portfolio company side. The portfolio company side is just another enterprise so we can group them into the enterprise pocket. They’re just asking very similar questions as any other advertisement. On the deal side, we’re doing a lot of diligence. We found it as right. And we started working. And we built all of our algorithms, our approaches and our methodologies to respond to diligence, because we knew that it was a very short timeframe, two, maybe three weeks to collect high volume of very niche respondents in high quality and we said if we can do that, we’d have the capabilities to serve other clients such as hedge funds, and enterprises. So private equity, again, diligence, a very large part of our work. For hedge funds, it’s a slightly different flavor. They’re doing a lot more market style research, but they’re doing it over time. So they are very interested in understanding trends and how they translate and change over time, because they’re looking to deploy our skill set and our capabilities to capture trends. And they want to know when the market has been an uptick before it upticks and downtick before down ticks, and it’s a lot more complex than that, but At the highest level of hedge funds tend to focus on time based surveys. And finally, enterprises focus a lot across a range of different topics. We do surveys on company performance. So that’s their customer performance or their competitors, customers performance. We’ve done surveys and demand funnel is what it’s called. It’s, it’s how effective is your sales cycle? Are people actually aware of your product? Considering your product buying your product? And how often are you winning and losing to specific competitors, and why we’re doing strategic surveys, so things to help with surveys that can help bring data that one to five year strategies that can help underpin the assumptions or underpin the business models by serving a broad range of customers, prospects, new markets, new geographies, competitive customers, etc. to capture information about their purchasing behaviors and their decision making. We do a lot on r&d and innovation. So testing new product concepts, new service concepts, new designs, on what’s going to be trying to understand really what’s going to be in fact impactful for customers and competitive customers and prospects. And then finally, we do a lot in customer mark, sorry, go to market set and segmentation. So really trying to break down the market and really trying to understand what is it people are buying? What are those buying situations? What’s driving those purchase decisions? And where are people going when they have certain critical factors that they’re looking to solve with the purchase? That answer your question it does.

Will Bachman 26:34
Let’s talk a little about the survey that you recently did. I believe you interviewed business owners about the impact of the Coronavirus. Tell me kind of how that survey came about and about some of your findings.

Eli Diament 26:50
Yeah, for sure. This, this was an interesting one, it was it was very different for us. We on this one, like I described before we we kind of break the world into two universities, finding the right people and then putting them through a very rigorous methodology to get data. In this case, our client, peak prosperity came to us and said, we have the people we want you to survey. And there’s a lot of them, there’s 360,000 subscribers and viewers of our content, we want you to go collect data from them on the impact of COVID on their personal lives and their business lives. And we want to get that information out there. So that people around the world can make decisions better so that business people can make decisions and personal people can make personal decisions better than they are. And so it’s an exciting one for us, because I rarely can talk about the research results. And on this one, we have an n equals 4500 survey that I can talk to and the insights are pretty interesting when you start to unpick them. Do you want me to jump in is that?

Will Bachman 27:55
Yeah, and I think we can mention, let me Let’s mention your website, we’ll include a link to this survey results in the show notes. But you can Why don’t you just give it now. So if people want to

Eli Diament 28:05
Yeah, it’s azurite Consulting and azurite, az URIT, consulting calm. And right there on the top, you can see a link to our Business Report, which was released. And if you want to get into lots of detail, there’s a whole slide pack that underpins all the data on talking to you, that gives you a lot of detail to help your business and really understand the impact and extended length of this recovery.

Will Bachman 28:30
Yeah, and I went through the whole detailed report, I thought it was really, really cool insights, what were some of the most surprising findings for you?

Eli Diament 28:39
I think that at the highest level, the the length of this recovery has really been a little bit disturbing. I think as I look at the data, and I look what’s going to happen in the next six months, a year, 18 months, two years. I think we as a society, and we as business advisors, and businesses have a long way to run on what’s gonna play out from COVID-19. When you start to unpick the results, you see that going forward, I think is going to be impacted by two major things. Number one is changing work environment, the amount of change that’s rapidly occurred in terms of digital uptake, and people working from home is going to have a very long term impact in terms of the way we do business. The other pieces the time, that it’s going to take people to get back to normal lives. And I think that’s going to be a lot longer than anyone expects. And so I can unpick each one of those a little bit more and give some of the statistics that I think underpin that. But for me, again, the length of the recovery, even though we can all envision it’s going to be this w thing going on where we’re kind of chasing COVID and then it’s chasing us Then we’re chasing it. And then we’re chasing, it’s chasing us. Even though we kind of knew that that was going to go for a while, I don’t think at least I hadn’t conceptualized just how large and long that recovery and impact is going to be.

Will Bachman 30:13
So the respondents anticipated that things are not getting back to normal in two to three months, but it’s going to be a year or two, before things even creep back to where they were. If

Eli Diament 30:25
I think the respondents, I don’t know, if it was anticipated as the word I would use? Well, I think it’s more the data that they gave us seem to indicate that it’s going to be a prolonged recovery. So for example, 70% of business executives and small business owners think that they’re going to need fewer people to complete the same amount of work in the future as a result of what’s happened now. So that’s a lot fewer people that are going to have employment. And when you look at today’s I think it was in the wall. So it was in the Washington Post 77% of people indicate that they think they’re getting their job back. Well, that really conflicts with 70% of managers saying, we’re going to hire fewer, fewer people, that that’s disturbing. When you start to look at managers, and when you ask 95% of executives, think that in the future, we’re going to need to be traveling less for business travel than we ever did before because of the digital tools that are being adopted. And it’s really going to make people reconsider the digital tools that are being adopted, that’s a whole chunk of the economy that’s just going to fall out that’s that’s hundreds of 1000s of dollars on a flight of Business Class seats that are just not going to be being paid for anymore, because we’re not going to be traveling for business nearly as much as we did. Not because we’re afraid to travel, but because we don’t need to anymore. And so that has major ramifications for the for the future and for the way we do business and for the amount of economic activity that’s actually just had going on to, to foster business. And when you couple that with the number of people that are going to wait for a vaccine before they pick up normal life again. It’s just astounding when 36% of people that took a business class, sorry, that took an international flight in 2019. say they’re not going to take another international flight until there’s a vaccine, that that that makes you scratch your head when when 25% of people that are avid cruisers. So these are people that have done more than three cruises in the last three years, that’s a cruising year for the last three years, when 25% of them say they’re never going on a cruise again, that’s an astounding amount of economic activity, that’s how they’re going to be stalled or does never occur. And whether you believe the number or not whether you say you know what people don’t know, people are notoriously bad at understanding what their future self is going to look like. Cut the number in half is 12. and a half percent of people that are avid cruisers are going on a cruise a year, and never going on a cruise again, that’s still 12 and a half percent less cruises going on. It’s scary numbers. And so that was one of the big surprises to us is that this is going to have permanent, permanent impacts on the economic the amount of economic activity that we have in a society. And I think we’re gonna have to grapple with how we recover from that when there’s a lot less economic activity going on. Another thing that really surprised us was the amount of people that are losing trust in our institutions. We didn’t cover this nearly as much depth depth as when you go on the peak prosperity site, they ran a whole bunch of the survey results that were around voting and were around changing and voting dynamic. But for us from a business perspective, people are losing trust in the federal government. 73% of respondents said they lost trust in the last six weeks in the federal government.

Will Bachman 33:57
Wait, say that again? Say that again.

Eli Diament 33:59
73% of respondents said they lost trust. In the federal government. They didn’t say they lost 100% of trust, but they lost. They trust the government less now than they did for COVID-19.

Will Bachman 34:11
Yeah. And I read and I saw that your results. You also looked at state and local. So how did the trust change with state and local governments?

Eli Diament 34:20
So state state it was about neutral, we had about 34% increase trust 41% decrease trust and in local 22% increase and 30% decrease. But the other side that I haven’t told is a number of people that stayed the same. So if I were to synthesize that up, federal government’s losing a lot states lost a little and locals lost a little bit not nearly as much but people are losing faith in our institutions. And that’s just astounding. If you think about as a society of 330 million people. We need some form of coordination to help us get through this to help us recover. And if people in individuals are losing that trust and And a large number of people said they’re never going to take the vaccine It was 29% said they never intend to get the vaccine for COVID-19. So whether you’re decided undecided or not, that’s still a large chunk of our society that’s losing trust and not going to take potential steps to decrease the risk. That’s going to extend the recovery even longer. And it’s just scary. It’s very scary to us

Will Bachman 35:22
that that that part about the the sort of anti vaccination, you know, thing about 29% saying they won’t take a vaccine that surprised me. What? This deadly disease if you don’t want the vaccine, do it? I mean, I can understand maybe you want to wait a month or two, six months or three, maybe six months to see if you know other people who take it. But I’ve never been taken vaccine. What?

Eli Diament 35:48
Yeah, it there were some head scratchers in there was like, wow, this is what’s going on in our society, and we’re losing trust in institutions. And we’re not going to trust the groups that are supposed to help us recovery. How are we going to recover? And I’m not a doomsday person, but this was this was scary to me.

Will Bachman 36:06
Yeah. So listeners, you can check out those the full results, and they’re fascinating. As right consulting.com we’ll include that link in the show notes. Ellie this Eli, he like you gotta get used to the the Israeli pronunciation you like. It’s been great chatting with you hearing about, you know how you built a survey firm, focused and you’re responding to the needs that you had as a consultant. Thanks so much for joining the show today.

Eli Diament 36:36
Yeah, thanks for having me. Well, it’s always a pleasure to talk with you to talk about surveys I’m quite passionate about solid strong data. So I’m always happy to speak with you about it.

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